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  1. #1
    EarthBound RocknRollStar's Avatar
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    Low and High GI and Glycemic Load

    At www.Nutritiondata.com they have all kinds of sweet information about foods.
    One of them is the Gylcemic Load of a food? Is this the same as GI or is it different?

    A banana has a Glycemic Load of 21

    And a Apple has a Glycemic Load of 4

    Does this mean the banana digest faster or digest slower?

    Can someone please explain?!
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    Surgeon By 2012 or Bust! -Aaron-'s Avatar
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    Honestly, this isn't the forum to ask about the G.I. index.
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    Originally Posted by RocknRollStar View Post
    At www.Nutritiondata.com they have all kinds of sweet information about foods.
    One of them is the Gylcemic Load of a food? Is this the same as GI or is it different?

    A banana has a Glycemic Load of 21

    And a Apple has a Glycemic Load of 4

    Does this mean the banana digest faster or digest slower?

    Can someone please explain?!
    (GI) is a numerical system of measuring how fast a carbohydrate triggers a rise in circulating blood sugar. (GL) assess the impact of carbohydrate consumption that takes the glycemic index into account, but gives a more accurate picture than does glycemic index alone.

    An example... watermelon has a high glycemic index of about 72. A serving size of 120 grams of watermelon has 6 grams of available carbohydrate per serving, so its glycemic load is very low, about 4. That's why the confusion of GI, which is actually important, but most here tend to discount it completely.
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    EarthBound RocknRollStar's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by -Aaron- View Post
    Honestly, this isn't the forum to ask about the G.I. index.
    ....? its the nutrition forum? Where else?!
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    Surgeon By 2012 or Bust! -Aaron-'s Avatar
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    Originally Posted by RocknRollStar View Post
    ....? its the nutrition forum? Where else?!
    Everyone is on the "G.I. is irrelevant" bandwagon... Which is why I made the comment I did.
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    Originally Posted by -Aaron- View Post
    Everyone is on the "G.I. is irrelevant" bandwagon... Which is why I made the comment I did.
    thank god someone has the balls to say the truth.
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    what im confused? So the GI of foods really doesn't matter?!
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    Wait.... I'm Confused, so the GI of foods really doesn't matter!?
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    Someone prove to me how GI is relevant in the context of bodybuilding nutrition. Go 'head payple.
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    Originally Posted by alan aragon View Post
    Someone prove to me how GI is relevant in the context of bodybuilding nutrition. Go 'head payple.
    bodybyilder A fasts for 8 hours and then consumes a 100 gram serving of white bread and not ezekiel bread to win a bet proving that white bread GI matters over wheat bread...


    ...other than that i find no context in which it would apply
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    Originally Posted by AllGenetix View Post
    bodybyilder A fasts for 8 hours and then consumes a 100 gram serving of white bread and not ezekiel bread to win a bet proving that white bread GI matters over wheat bread...


    ...other than that i find no context in which it would apply
    but then 5 minutes later takes down 4 tablespoons of peanut butter?
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    Originally Posted by scoch View Post
    but then 5 minutes later takes down 4 tablespoons of peanut butter?
    peanut butter then blunting the insulin response of the white bread significantly decreasing plasma blood glucose levels rendering GI useless
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  13. #13
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    Waiting for someone to educate me on the wonders of giving a fck about GI
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    Registered User baarat's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by alan aragon View Post
    Waiting for someone to educate me on the wonders of giving a fck about GI
    It's rediculious that amount of posts about carbs on this forum. Low carbs, nocarbs, should I cycle carbs, carb load, carb sensitive, carb resistant, should i eat fruit, potatoes are bad, no carbs at night, carbs around workouts blah....blah....blah........and now gi is irrelevant. It doesn't surprise me.
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    if GI didn't matter than obesity in america would not be such a problem. there'd still be fat ppl. but probably not as bad or so many. GI is extremely important. who likes insulin spikes and then crashing energy levels throughout the day?
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    Originally Posted by alan aragon View Post
    Waiting for someone to educate me on the wonders of giving a fck about GI
    I trust Alan's advice...I don't need any further explanation at this time...

    http://alanaragon.com/elements-chall...mic-index.html
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    Originally Posted by alan aragon View Post
    Waiting for someone to educate me on the wonders of giving a fck about GI
    Well, if I eat a high-carb meal with only high GI carbs, I get hungry afterwards much more quickly and tend to go hypo.

    No not pleasant on the hypo front - especially if I get dizzy while driving - that could certainly be detrimental to my goals.

    Plus I'll tend to eat a lot more - not so great when trying to cut.

    Of course a moderate amount of higher GI carbs with veg is not a problem. 1/2 a potato + 4 cups of veg and 6oz chicken, no-one should be worrying about the GI of the potato.
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    Originally Posted by crazymutha View Post
    I trust Alan's advice...I don't need any further explanation at this time...

    http://alanaragon.com/elements-chall...mic-index.html
    I also respect Alan's advice and read just about everything he writes, kudo's to him. Maybe it's just the word irrelevant that bothers me. One of GI's contradictions is GL which is based on the GI index/ratio, therfore GL is also irrelevant. It's complicated, no doubt about it. But I have a feeling it ain't that simple to just discount it completely.
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    By JOHN C. DRAKE
    Associated Press Writer


    COLUMBIA, S.C.


    Diets that distinguish between "good carbs" and "bad carbs," are not an effective way of controlling blood sugar levels, a new study suggests.

    Although made popular by the South Beach Diet and others, the glycemic index has never been fully embraced by most dietitians and remains a point of debate among scientists.

    Now, diabetes researcher Elizabeth Mayer-Davis of the University of South Carolina says the use of the index should be ended altogether in favor of more traditional methods of losing weight and reducing the risk of diabetes _ eating less and exercising more.

    "The glycemic index is sufficiently flawed as an index that it is not helpful for scientists or people trying to create a healthy diet," Mayer-Davis said.

    The glycemic index is a 100-point scale, with white bread at 100 points, that measures how quickly carbohydrates enter the bloodstream as sugar.

    According to index supporters, people should avoid high-glycemic foods such as white bread and potatoes because they will quickly raise a person's blood-sugar level. Meanwhile, low-glycemic foods such as carrots and apples are absorbed more slowly, making a person feel full longer and reducing cravings, which helps with weight loss.

    Promoters of the diet also say that eating low-glycemic foods will result in less fluctuation in their blood sugar levels.

    Both the Atkins and South Beach diets have raised interest in the theory, and an entire series, "The Glucose Revolution," guides consumers through a diet based on it.

    Beth Kunkel, a professor of food science and human nutrition at Clemson University and president of the South Carolina Dietetic Association, said that while there is debate among dietitians about its validity, it would be a mistake to reject the concept altogether. Kunkel was not involved in the University of South Carolina study.

    "To just reject it out of hand and quit working on it would be a mistake," Kunkel said. "I just think we're five to 10 years away from really understanding it from a research viewpoint."

    Previous studies have shown conflicting results. One small study showed that people on a low-glycemic diet were less hungry later in the day than a group fed a high-glycemic diet. Another study, involving 39 overweight people, showed that those on a low-glycemic diet lowered their risk of heart disease. Both studies were conducted by Dr. David Ludwig of Boston's Children's Hospital.

    However, American Heart Association officials have disputed the significance of those findings.

    The new study, published in the February issue of the British Journal of Nutrition, relied on food questionnaires from more than 1,000 people over five years and assessed their consumption of high- and low-glycemic foods. Researchers tested their blood sugar levels twice during the study period and found no significant correlation between the glycemic index of foods and the blood-sugar levels of participants.

    Mayer-Davis said that researchers should develop a new measure of how different carbohydrates can affect health. She said a better index would be based on the physical characteristics of foods, such as fat content and calories, because numerous factors influence a food's effect on blood-sugar levels.
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    Originally Posted by alan aragon View Post
    Waiting for someone to educate me on the wonders of giving a fck about GI
    Alan, are you really preaching that Steel Cut Oats and Coco Pebbles have the same effect in a fat loss objective?
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    Originally Posted by Basil08 View Post
    Alan, are you really preaching that Steel Cut Oats and Coco Pebbles have the same effect in a fat loss objective?
    No son, GI index and sugar layden foods are two completely different aspects of nutrtion.
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    Originally Posted by Shaggytph View Post
    if GI didn't matter than obesity in america would not be such a problem. there'd still be fat ppl. but probably not as bad or so many. GI is extremely important. who likes insulin spikes and then crashing energy levels throughout the day?
    The obesity problem in America is not due to the GI of carbs consumed. It's due to an unused caloric excess from either too much sitting on your ass, too much eating, or a combination of both. Not too tough to comprehend.
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    Originally Posted by Basil08 View Post
    Alan, are you really preaching that Steel Cut Oats and Coco Pebbles have the same effect in a fat loss objective?
    Fat loss = makes no difference as long as amount of carb is matched. I have the science to back that statement up, I never talk out of my ass.

    Now if we're talking about long-term health, if you were on a moderate to high carb diet, & you were hypercaloric, then choosing coco pebbles as your sole carb source would be a jackoff move, now wouldn't it. GI & nutrient density are 2 different discussions.
    Last edited by alan aragon; 11-02-2007 at 11:21 AM.
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    Originally Posted by Jules Verne View Post
    Well, if I eat a high-carb meal with only high GI carbs, I get hungry afterwards much more quickly and tend to go hypo.

    No not pleasant on the hypo front - especially if I get dizzy while driving - that could certainly be detrimental to my goals.

    Plus I'll tend to eat a lot more - not so great when trying to cut.
    Surely this depends on the physical form of the carb source, I can imagine someone getting hungry soon after swigging their 1990's ABC-style mega dex/whey bomb, along with the BG swings in some individuals, but even that depends on the total amount of carbs in the dose. I have to ask why you would adopt this protocol (or what you described - a high-carb meal with only high GI carbs) in the first place.
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    Originally Posted by alan aragon View Post
    Surely this depends on the physical form of the carb source, I can imagine someone getting hungry soon after swigging their 1990's ABC-style mega dex/whey bomb, along with the BG swings in some individuals, but even that depends on the total amount of carbs in the dose. I have to ask why you would adopt this protocol (or what you described - a high-carb meal with only high GI carbs) in the first place.
    Well OK I agree. I don't eat like that, but it seems that quite a few people do.

    In the context of eating a 'good' diet with balanced, thought out meals to achieve one's goals that that are mostly 'natural' (or minimally processed) foods, GI is 'irrelevant'. Although I too am not keen on the 'irrelevant' wording. I prefer the way I've seen you more commonly phase it as 'not a primary consideration' when choosing carb sources.

    And even for controlling blood sugar/insulin the quantity of carbs (and makeup of the meal) is definitely more relevant than the GI.
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    Originally Posted by alan aragon View Post
    Fat loss = makes no difference as long as amount of carb is matched. I have the science to back that statement up, I never talk out of my ass.

    Now if we're talking about long-term health, if you were on a moderate to high carb diet, & you were hypercaloric, then choosing coco pebbles as your sole carb source would be a jackoff move, now wouldn't it. GI & nutrient density are 2 different discussions.
    There is absolutely no reason to reply in a tone that is more or less fuming, I have in no way stated that I you ?talk out of you a$$?, neither did my question possess any negative connotation along with it. I apologize if you thought my post had a unenthusiastic tone embedded in it, but I assure you it did not. I have simply asked a question, and in return been given a rash answer.

    Could you please provide the science that proves this, and in no way am i referring to any aspect of nutrient density.

    From what i understand from your reply, you stand firmly by the Cals In vs. Cals Out, no matter what type of macros they are composed of.

    P.S. Sorry for the late reply
    Last edited by Basil08; 11-02-2007 at 11:43 AM.
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    Prove you're worth a damn DJohnson's Avatar
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    Given the same caloric intake and macro breakdown, high GI vs low GI won't have an effect on body composition.

    Although eating healthy carbs are more nutritious and will therefore make you healthier, they won't make you go hypo like Jules mentioned which can make you eat more. The high fibre will keep you full longer, improve your blood lipid profile.

    And no, Alan is NOT saying macros don't matter. He's saying with the same macros and calories, carb souces don't matter.
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    Originally Posted by Basil08 View Post
    There is absolutely no reason to reply in a tone that is more or less fuming, I have in no way stated that I you ?talk out of you a$$?, neither did my question possess any negative connotation along with it. I apologize if you thought my post had a unenthusiastic tone embedded in it, but I assure you it did not. I have simply asked a question, and in return been given a rash answer.

    Could you please provide the science that proves this, and in no way am i referring to any aspect of nutrient density.

    From what i understand from your reply, you stand firmly by the Cals In vs. Cals Out, no matter what type of macros they are composed of.

    P.S. Sorry for the late reply
    Originally Posted by DJohnson View Post
    Given the same caloric intake and macro breakdown, high GI vs low GI won't have an effect on body composition.

    Although eating healthy carbs are more nutritious and will therefore make you healthier, they won't make you go hypo like Jules mentioned which can make you eat more. The high fibre will keep you full longer, improve your blood lipid profile.

    And no, Alan is NOT saying macros don't matter. He's saying with the same macros and calories, carb souces don't matter.
    what i meant by type (which i realize i did not explain well) was what you stated.
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    ballin' on a budget Shaggytph's Avatar
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    this is all blowing my mind. i guess i've been worrying too much about the GI of my carbs lately
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    My advice investigate all claims made by fitness industry.

    Long-term effects of 2 energy-restricted diets differing in glycemic load on dietary adherence, body composition, and metabolism in CALERIE: a 1-y randomized controlled trial.
    Am J Clin Nutr. 2007 Apr;85(4):1023-30

    SK Das et. al.

    BACKGROUND: There remains no consensus about the optimal dietary composition for sustained weight loss. OBJECTIVE: The objective was to examine the effects of 2 dietary macronutrient patterns with different glycemic loads on adherence to a prescribed regimen of calorie restriction (CR), weight and fat loss, and related variables. DESIGN: A randomized controlled trial (RCT) of diets with a high glycemic load (HG) or a low glycemic load (LG) at 30% CR was conducted in 34 healthy overweight adults with a mean (+/-SD) age of 35 +/- 6 y and body mass index (kg/m(2)) of 27.6 +/- 1.4. All food was provided for 6 mo in diets controlled for confounding variables, and subjects self-administered the plans for 6 additional months. Primary and secondary outcomes included energy intake measured by doubly labeled water, body weight and fatness, hunger, satiety, and resting metabolic rate. RESULTS: All groups consumed significantly less energy during CR than at baseline (P < 0.01), but changes in energy intake, body weight, body fat, and resting metabolic rate did not differ significantly between groups. Both groups ate more energy than provided (eg, 21% and 28% CR at 3 mo and 16% and 17% CR at 6 mo with HG and LG, respectively). Percentage weight change at 12 mo was -8.04 +/- 4.1% in the HG group and -7.81 +/- 5.0% in the LG group. There was no effect of dietary composition on changes in hunger, satiety, or satisfaction with the amount and type of provided food during CR. CONCLUSIONS: These findings provide more detailed evidence to suggest that diets differing substantially in glycemic load induce comparable long-term weight loss.

    Wonder what the Quack-Jobs at Nutrisystems would think of this or the mounds of other research that had similar findings. You know, Nutrisystems the people that just discovered the GI Index a few years ago and swear you can eat as much Low Gi Nutrisystems food as you would like whithout gaining weight.

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