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Thread: Cut or bulk?

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    Cut or bulk?

    I’ve been going in circles since forever and i’ve had enough so i’m just gonna stick to a bulk or cut for months and stop switching between the two. (I hate the fat at my lower chest, is this just stubborn fat?)

    Age: 25
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    Originally Posted by Cautious1 View Post
    I’ve been going in circles since forever and i’ve had enough so i’m just gonna stick to a bulk or cut for months and stop switching between the two. (I hate the fat at my lower chest, is this just stubborn fat?)

    Age: 25
    Weight: 83.8KG/ 184.7lbs
    Height: 5”11

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    You should cut and get on a good training program and stick to it consistently.

    Based on the size of your ankles (and overall frame) your ideal weight is probably more in the 70-75 kg range, and that’s after years of consistent training and solid nutrition.
    The first principle is that you must not fool yourself—and you are the easiest person to fool.

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    Originally Posted by EiFit91 View Post
    You should cut and get on a good training program and stick to it consistently.

    Based on the size of your ankles (and overall frame) your ideal weight is probably more in the 70-75 kg range, and that’s after years of consistent training and solid nutrition.
    Thanks for the response. Ive been to 70-75KG and I looked like I was on the verge of death lol but I gained the weight back too quick when bulking and had to start again (See below at 71KG)

    Side: https://ibb.co/bvpTjP4
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    Back: https://ibb.co/sRwd1pJ
    Back Flexed: https://ibb.co/0fkNzmm

    So your suggesting I get back down to 70-75KG range then do a slow lean bulk on a good program/ nutrition?
    Last edited by Cautious1; 07-29-2022 at 01:29 AM.
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    I think you look pretty healthy at 71kg, although I'm sure you would have looked skinny with a shirt on. I'm 2 inches taller and got down to 70kg on my first cut.
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    Originally Posted by RapidFail View Post
    I think you look pretty healthy at 71kg, although I'm sure you would have looked skinny with a shirt on. I'm 2 inches taller and got down to 70kg on my first cut.
    When I was at 71KG, I had a few people tell me I was way too skinny and thought I was dying. What weight did you cut down to 70KG from? And how long did it take you?
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    Originally Posted by Cautious1 View Post
    When I was at 71KG, I had a few people tell me I was way too skinny and thought I was dying. What weight did you cut down to 70KG from? And how long did it take you?
    I will take that 71kg any day of the week. Those people probably dont lift and maybe fat. I will start cutting and do lean bulk afterwards if i were you.
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    Originally Posted by userKCE2FBSXXR8 View Post
    I will take that 71kg any day of the week. Those people probably dont lift and maybe fat. I will start cutting and do lean bulk afterwards if i were you.
    From the responses, looks like Im getting back down to 71KG... That was the most difficult thing I've ever done. Took me like 5/6 Months to get down to 71KG from 83/84KG
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    What if I lean bulk for 6 months then cut for 4/5 months? Because I dont really have much muscle to cut down to right now
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    Originally Posted by Cautious1 View Post
    What if I lean bulk for 6 months then cut for 4/5 months? Because I dont really have much muscle to cut down to right now
    never bulk from that spot... just eat at maintenance or cut, then lean bulk in a few months
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    Originally Posted by faithbrah View Post
    never bulk from that spot... just eat at maintenance or cut, then lean bulk in a few months
    Im curious to know why you say eat at maintenance, I'll just be at the same weight/ spot right? Anyway ive decided to cut eating 1800Kcal a day and monitor my weight and adjust so im losing 0.7KG/1.5lb and hopefully that will take 4 months to reach 71-75KG range. Then I will start a lean bulk and not **** it up for the 4th year lol
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    Originally Posted by Cautious1 View Post
    When I was at 71KG, I had a few people tell me I was way too skinny and thought I was dying. What weight did you cut down to 70KG from? And how long did it take you?
    I was 77kg to begin with - the first pic in my gallery shows my starting condition, I had little muscle mass and a belly. I did a slow cut - I don't remember how long it took.
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    Originally Posted by Cautious1 View Post
    Im curious to know why you say eat at maintenance, I'll just be at the same weight/ spot right? Anyway ive decided to cut eating 1800Kcal a day and monitor my weight and adjust so im losing 0.7KG/1.5lb and hopefully that will take 4 months to reach 71-75KG range. Then I will start a lean bulk and not **** it up for the 4th year lol
    you might be able to make gains on maintenance too and improve your body composition. i suggested maintenance because it seemed like you really wanted to bulk
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    Originally Posted by RapidFail View Post
    I was 77kg to begin with - the first pic in my gallery shows my starting condition, I had little muscle mass and a belly. I did a slow cut - I don't remember how long it took.
    Ah okay, I looked nothing like you at 77KG lol, i must have literally no muscle
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    Originally Posted by faithbrah View Post
    you might be able to make gains on maintenance too and improve your body composition. i suggested maintenance because it seemed like you really wanted to bulk
    Oh okay I understand, and yeh i really wanted to bulk but I think im still going to do what i decided but thank you
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    Originally Posted by Cautious1 View Post
    Ive been to 70-75KG and I looked like I was on the verge of death lol
    Verge of death to you looks healthy & much better to me. Right now you look like a chubby guy who never picked up a weight.

    Tbh people who can't tell fat from muscle, and who only get fat when they try to bulk, should never try to "bulk" IMO. You'll always look better when cutting or eating around maintenance when at a healthy weight.
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    Youve got boobs. Of course you should cut. Work hard in your training while you cut and you should be able to put on a tiny bit of muscle while cutting aswell
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    Originally Posted by air2fakie View Post
    Verge of death to you looks healthy & much better to me. Right now you look like a chubby guy who never picked up a weight.

    Tbh people who can't tell fat from muscle, and who only get fat when they try to bulk, should never try to "bulk" IMO. You'll always look better when cutting or eating around maintenance when at a healthy weight.
    Oh really, you could see my rib cages stick out when I was at 71KG so thought that would of meant im too skinny. Looks like I need to get back down to 70KG and then just maintain
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    Originally Posted by safcpaul View Post
    Youve got boobs. Of course you should cut. Work hard in your training while you cut and you should be able to put on a tiny bit of muscle while cutting aswell
    The lower chest fat is impossible to get rid of, its literally the last place fat comes off. Its still slightly visible around 70-75kg range but I will continue to lift heavy and hit protein/ fats while cutting
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    Originally Posted by Cautious1 View Post
    Oh really, you could see my rib cages stick out when I was at 71KG so thought that would of meant im too skinny. Looks like I need to get back down to 70KG and then just maintain
    I'm not saying you were that muscular back then, but it's a much better look than now. But in the end it's up to you & how you want to look.

    IMO if you have visual trouble identifying when you're fat, tend to just become fat when bulking, don't track nutrition/cals well or at all, & have a deficiency in your training, it's best to either be around maintenance when not cutting.

    You'd prob end up gaining weight even if you "tried" to eat around maintenance if you're not tracking cals well, so no need to consciously bulk once you get down to a better bf level.
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    Originally Posted by air2fakie View Post
    I'm not saying you were that muscular back then, but it's a much better look than now. But in the end it's up to you & how you want to look.

    IMO if you have visual trouble identifying when you're fat, tend to just become fat when bulking, don't track nutrition/cals well or at all, & have a deficiency in your training, it's best to either be around maintenance when not cutting.

    You'd prob end up gaining weight even if you "tried" to eat around maintenance if you're not tracking cals well, so no need to consciously bulk once you get down to a better bf level.
    Okay thanks for the useful info! I shall take it all into account
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    Originally Posted by Cautious1 View Post
    Ah okay, I looked nothing like you at 77KG lol, i must have literally no muscle
    I had very little muscle too - I just store my fat on my belly and love handles, not my chest. I hate how I looked then, though at the time it was normal to me. I'm 76kg in my profile pic, which was after bulking up to 81kg and cutting back down again.

    Out of interest, how long did it take you to bulk up from 71kg to your current weight and what was your diet and training like?
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    Originally Posted by Cautious1 View Post
    Thanks for the response. Ive been to 70-75KG and I looked like I was on the verge of death lol but I gained the weight back too quick when bulking and had to start again (See below at 71KG)

    Side: https://ibb.co/bvpTjP4
    Front: https://ibb.co/WFZGkNd
    Front Flexed: https://ibb.co/zGKBJdT
    Back: https://ibb.co/sRwd1pJ
    Back Flexed: https://ibb.co/0fkNzmm

    So your suggesting I get back down to 70-75KG range then do a slow lean bulk on a good program/ nutrition?
    You're about 20% BF in those pics. You were far away from "verge of death", just undermuscled. Will take years of solid training and diet to get to say 12-15% at that weight.

    Agree with air2fakie that people who just spin their wheels bulking are better of just eating and training at maintenance. Just staying in the 70-75 kg range while lifting heavy on a solid program for years will lead to good results.
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    Originally Posted by RapidFail View Post
    I had very little muscle too - I just store my fat on my belly and love handles, not my chest. I hate how I looked then, though at the time it was normal to me. I'm 76kg in my profile pic, which was after bulking up to 81kg and cutting back down again.

    Out of interest, how long did it take you to bulk up from 71kg to your current weight and what was your diet and training like?
    I store my fat on belly and lower chest area and then my back I think.

    It took me 5 or 6 months to go from 82KG to 71KG however my diet consisted of mainly plain chicken breast and rice and on weekend junk food but within calories and some days i’d go abit over and i’d try compensate for it the next day so not 100% consistent. Training started solid on a strength program but eventually lost consistency and started to miss leg days here and there so overall not the perfect cut which is probably why it took 5 months.

    Here’s a before and after pics from 2020

    June 2020 - Nov 2020 Cut:
    https://ibb.co/mcKLbb4

    Then started to Bulk:
    https://ibb.co/DQB99cp
    https://ibb.co/b7X4dsq
    Last edited by Cautious1; 07-29-2022 at 08:52 AM.
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    Originally Posted by EiFit91 View Post
    You're about 20% BF in those pics. You were far away from "verge of death", just undermuscled. Will take years of solid training and diet to get to say 12-15% at that weight.

    Agree with air2fakie that people who just spin their wheels bulking are better of just eating and training at maintenance. Just staying in the 70-75 kg range while lifting heavy on a solid program for years will lead to good results.
    Yeh took me like 4 years to learn that. I’m definitely not making the same mistake this time and I’m just going to eat at maintenance once I’ve finished my cut because I do not want to cut ever again it sucks.
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    There's nothing wrong with the way you looked at 71kg. Everyone in the world is so fat these days when they see an actual normal weight person they assume he's sick or something.
    IG: @ironhousetraining

    All it takes is consistency, effort, proper nutrition, good programming, and TIME.

    Don't be upset with the results you didn't get from the work you did not do.
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    One extreme to another

    Bulking is one extreme and cutting is another. In terms of health too much protein and too little carbs and other nutrients isn’t good. Just balance both and you will be fine
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    Originally Posted by Cautious1 View Post
    I store my fat on belly and lower chest area and then my back I think.

    It took me 5 or 6 months to go from 82KG to 71KG however my diet consisted of mainly plain chicken breast and rice and on weekend junk food but within calories and some days i’d go abit over and i’d try compensate for it the next day so not 100% consistent. Training started solid on a strength program but eventually lost consistency and started to miss leg days here and there so overall not the perfect cut which is probably why it took 5 months.

    Here’s a before and after pics from 2020

    June 2020 - Nov 2020 Cut:
    https://ibb.co/mcKLbb4

    Then started to Bulk:
    https://ibb.co/DQB99cp
    https://ibb.co/b7X4dsq
    What I was wondering is how long you spent bulkung up from 71kg, I wondered whether gaining weight too fast contributed to excessive fat gain. If training wasn't consistent when bulking then fat gain was inevitable.
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    Originally Posted by xsquid99 View Post
    There's nothing wrong with the way you looked at 71kg. Everyone in the world is so fat these days when they see an actual normal weight person they assume he's sick or something.
    If only I knew that back then, would of maintained instead of bulking and messing up and starting all over again
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    Originally Posted by rwatson123 View Post
    Bulking is one extreme and cutting is another. In terms of health too much protein and too little carbs and other nutrients isn’t good. Just balance both and you will be fine
    Consistency is what the downfall was for me, this time round I wont make the same mistake and ensuring I hit protein/ fats/ carbs!
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    Originally Posted by RapidFail View Post
    What I was wondering is how long you spent bulkung up from 71kg, I wondered whether gaining weight too fast contributed to excessive fat gain. If training wasn't consistent when bulking then fat gain was inevitable.
    I cant remember how long I bulked for tbh, might of been a few months then cutting for a month then bulking again and going in circles achieving nothing which was my mistake. And I wasnt consistent with calories, sometimes I would go over the 300Kcal increase
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