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    Registered User ManwittaPlan's Avatar
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    Who has used creatine for sleep deprivation

    Today I wish I did, never crossed my mind. Had to be up a couple hours earlier than usual and attend a training class/practical. Coffee was doing nothing.

    Tomorrow might be the same so we’ll see if I take 5 grams with my morning coffee (haven’t used it in a long time) if it makes things any better compared to today. I’ll start with 5 grams tonight as well.
    my info is GOLD
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    up the dosage eatyourspinach's Avatar
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    there are other less subtle things for this if you were really so inclined to try them
    My secret? Texting between sets.
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    Took a quick dive through examine(dot)com and found no substantial indicators of energy improvement. Creatine is amazing for many things; a morning stimulant doesn't seem to be one of those things. I take roughy 4-7g per day and it's never really been a supplement that has any noticeable effect on my general health. (Not to say it isn't - just not to a perceivable degree for me at least.) Only time I notice Creatine is when I stop taking it and hit the weights after a week or so. Onset of fatigue and lactic acid seems to creep up sooner, but even then it's not a night and day difference.

    Try it, though... Might be able to capitalize on a little placebo boost. Crazy what we can do if we convince our minds something is working.
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    Originally Posted by eatyourspinach View Post
    there are other less subtle things for this if you were really so inclined to try them
    Share them please!

    I did the alcar upon waking and just took some cordyceps

    I knew today and yesterday I wouldn’t have enough total sleep because of my schedule but ANY input I’d appreciate sir
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    Originally Posted by FeedinSeason View Post
    Try it, though... Might be able to capitalize on a little placebo boost. Crazy what we can do if we convince our minds something is working.
    Far from a placebo

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16416332/
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    I have creatine in my morning protein shake everyday and I've done that for the last several years, never noticed a difference on days I slept less. It looks like that study found some changes in a 24hr sleep deprivation period, tough to say if you would get any noticeable differences on a few hours less sleep. I'd like to see some other studies on it, creatine for strength purposes works with saturation after taken for multiple days. Not sure how a single acute dose in the AM, especially in athletes/lifters who already take it, would have much effect.

    Edit: Missed they did take it multiple times for 4 days leading up. Still not sure how this would work on those of us who have already been taking it for years.
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    up the dosage eatyourspinach's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ManwittaPlan View Post
    Share them please!

    I did the alcar upon waking and just took some cordyceps

    I knew today and yesterday I wouldn’t have enough total sleep because of my schedule but ANY input I’d appreciate sir
    In order of intensity I would suggest high salidroside rhodiola combined with nitrosigine -->sulbutiamine-->phenylpiracetam (can't be used daily)-->things that end in -afnil
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    Originally Posted by ManwittaPlan View Post
    This is interesting, keep us posted on your thoughts
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    Cybergenics...it's bomb! lucia316's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Ghawk21 View Post
    I have creatine in my morning protein shake everyday and I've done that for the last several years, never noticed a difference on days I slept less. It looks like that study found some changes in a 24hr sleep deprivation period, tough to say if you would get any noticeable differences on a few hours less sleep. I'd like to see some other studies on it, creatine for strength purposes works with saturation after taken for multiple days. Not sure how a single acute dose in the AM, especially in athletes/lifters who already take it, would have much effect.

    Edit: Missed they did take it multiple times for 4 days leading up. Still not sure how this would work on those of us who have already been taking it for years.
    And we can't see any of the data. There is nothing interesting or data to lead to any belief that there is anything of real world significance in that abstract. Not paying $40 to find out how much more than statistical significance they achieved in "RMG, choice reaction time, balance and mood state." Further, how they objectively measured "mood state."
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    I’ve had a tub of creatine sitting on my counter for like six months now I haven’t opened. Always forget to take it. I often get little sleep. Going to try it and report back
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    Originally Posted by lucia316 View Post
    And we can't see any of the data. There is nothing interesting or data to lead to any belief that there is anything of real world significance in that abstract. Not paying $40 to find out how much more than statistical significance they achieved in "RMG, choice reaction time, balance and mood state." Further, how they objectively measured "mood state."
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    Originally Posted by eatyourspinach View Post
    In order of intensity I would suggest high salidroside rhodiola combined with nitrosigine -->sulbutiamine-->phenylpiracetam (can't be used daily)-->things that end in -afnil
    holy crap thank you sir! you always provide great info!

    i can google but are any of these that end in -afnil drugs or are they supplements? rhodiola i'll use on and off but have never delved into the others you mentioned.
    my info is GOLD
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    Registered User ManwittaPlan's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TheFugitive View Post
    Mr. Negative couldn't resist
    i like him just the way he is, insignificant
    my info is GOLD
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    Originally Posted by tbonestake View Post
    I’ve had a tub of creatine sitting on my counter for like six months now I haven’t opened. Always forget to take it. I often get little sleep. Going to try it and report back
    it can't hurt and it's dirt cheap, please do so i like real world feedback
    my info is GOLD
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    Originally Posted by Ghawk21 View Post
    I have creatine in my morning protein shake everyday and I've done that for the last several years, never noticed a difference on days I slept less. It looks like that study found some changes in a 24hr sleep deprivation period, tough to say if you would get any noticeable differences on a few hours less sleep. I'd like to see some other studies on it, creatine for strength purposes works with saturation after taken for multiple days. Not sure how a single acute dose in the AM, especially in athletes/lifters who already take it, would have much effect.

    Edit: Missed they did take it multiple times for 4 days leading up. Still not sure how this would work on those of us who have already been taking it for years.
    for someone that has been taking it long term i wonder, any benefit you've been getting this whole time since you last began using....but for someone like me who doesn't use creatine much (only for certain periods throughout the year) maybe i'll notice something. i did feel better today and this is day two of being deprived from my regular sleep cycle. purposely drank less coffee (2 kcups vs my usual 3 and).

    i'll be doing more labs for T levels again tomorrow morning, curious to see how a few days of deprivation will affect that as well.
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  16. #16
    up the dosage eatyourspinach's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ManwittaPlan View Post
    holy crap thank you sir! you always provide great info!

    i can google but are any of these that end in -afnil drugs or are they supplements? rhodiola i'll use on and off but have never delved into the others you mentioned.
    things that end in -afinil are strictly synthetic to be vague
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    Registered User ManwittaPlan's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by eatyourspinach View Post
    things that end in -afinil are strictly synthetic to be vague
    Just looked them up, those are controlled substances.
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  18. #18
    up the dosage eatyourspinach's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ManwittaPlan View Post
    Just looked them up, those are controlled substances.
    one isn't
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    Interesting Read,

    If you’re an athlete who uses supplements, chances are you’ve heard about Creatine. This supplement is best known for the physical benefits demonstrated by hundreds of studies, such as greater maximum strength, improved power output, and faster recovery. But did you know that creatine supplementation may also help you sleep better?

    While the majority of the research on creatine has focused on its efficacy as an ergogenic aid, there’s a growing body of evidence that demonstrates its potential to improve your sleep so you can bounce back better and quicker from interval and strength training, and even endurance sessions. It might also enable you to prevent declines in psychomotor skill expression and the lack of emotional control that can result from sleep deprivation.

    In a perfect world, every athlete would have a consistent schedule in which they’d go to bed and wake up at the same time and get adequate rest between team practices, individual workouts, and competitions. Yet we know all too well this isn’t how it works – you can’t always get the kind of sleep quality or duration you need to be your best. And yet you must continue to perform at a high level.

    According to a research team from University of Chichester in England, taking supplemental creatine enabled sleep-deprived participants to perform better on psychomotor and cognitive tests, to better regulate their emotional state, and to keep their levels of stress hormones low, even though they hadn’t slept for 24 hours. “Creatine supplementation had a positive effect on mood state and tasks that place a heavy stress on the prefrontal cortex,” the researchers, who published their findings in the journal Psychopharmacology, wrote.

    While we need to be cautious about extrapolating too much from animal studies, a team of four neuroscientists who published their findings in the Journal of Sleep Research found that creatine reduces the amount of sleep rats needed. Four weeks of dosing the rodents with creatine monohydrate also reduced their sleep pressure – in layman’s terms, how quickly they got tired on any given day. The researchers concluded that creatine monohydrate supplementation shows, “potential in the treatment of sleep-related disorders.”

    So what’s the mechanism for how creatine stabilizes your sleep-wake cycle? Let’s break it down. When you’re up and about during the day, adenosine triphosphate (ATP – which provides energy in cells during all physical and cognitive tasks) accumulates in the brain. So too does extracellular adenosine. As the levels of these two substances build up as daytime transitions into evening, ATP and adenosine start to trigger receptors in the brain that ready your body for sleep. This is known as your sleep drive.

    On the opposite end of the scale is your wake drive, which is running in high gear at those times of day when you’re sufficiently rested or pumped up on caffeine. That’s why it’s unlikely you could go back to bed and sleep an hour after waking and drinking a venti latte, but might be able to drift off for a mid-afternoon siesta when your sleep pressure had built up sufficiently and your sleep drive became stronger than your wake drive.

    Creatine supplementation increases the size of the phosphocreatine store pool in your brain. This enables you to buffer the alterations that take place in the see-saw between your wake drive and sleep drive that occurs as the day goes on. This buffering process is particularly valuable when you’re already tired from a lack of sleep quality and/or duration the night before, and then layer practice, weight training, and competition on top of this. Taking three to five milligrams of creatine daily won’t stop you from ever getting sleepy, but could offset the yawning, loss of energy, and decline in psychomotor skills that signal that your sleep drive is overtaking your wake drive.

    The takeaway? Keep taking creatine for the training boost it provides (read this article for a quick guide), and when you’re tired or run down (or are anticipating being so due to your practice, travel, or game/race schedule), make sure you don’t skip your daily dose.

    https://discover.livemomentous.com/a...nce%20sessions.
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    Creatine has a fairly short elimination half life, averaging just less than 3 hours, so to maintain an elevated plasma level it would be necessary to take small oral doses every 3–6 hours throughout the day.

    With creatine having a short half life would it be best to take a small dose a few hours prior to sleep?
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    up the dosage eatyourspinach's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TheFugitive View Post
    Creatine has a fairly short elimination half life, averaging just less than 3 hours, so to maintain an elevated plasma level it would be necessary to take small oral doses every 3–6 hours throughout the day.

    With creatine having a short half life would it be best to take a small dose a few hours prior to sleep?
    What about CEE?
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  22. #22
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    damn you guys, where were both of you ten years ago when i needed this info most!
    my info is GOLD
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    Originally Posted by eatyourspinach View Post
    What about CEE?
    you think that one's better?
    my info is GOLD
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    up the dosage eatyourspinach's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ManwittaPlan View Post
    you think that one's better?
    lol no but he does
    My secret? Texting between sets.
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    Originally Posted by eatyourspinach View Post
    lol no but he does
    i've read that the hcl makes more sense, let's see what his take is
    my info is GOLD
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  26. #26
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    Originally Posted by eatyourspinach View Post
    What about CEE?
    One BS study didn't prove much. CEE was the first form of creatine to challenge creatine monohydrate, and the study was funded by someone with major interests in CM

    Creatine is all about absorption, not what it's attached to. Some people tolerate CM just fine others including myself don't
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    Originally Posted by ManwittaPlan View Post
    i've read that the hcl makes more sense, let's see what his take is
    HCl is a great choice for those who have issues digesting CM
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    Originally Posted by TheFugitive View Post
    HCl is a great choice for those who have issues digesting CM
    i don't get the bloat when i've used the hcl. i've used the CM only because of price in the past but now am in the position that i'd rather pay for what works better for me.
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    Originally Posted by TheFugitive View Post
    Mr. Negative couldn't resist
    Good save posting a response on the correct account when you posted on the wrong account the first time
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    On day four of 5G a day. Using hcl. Sleep has been as bad or worse then it normally is. Caffeine intake and nutrition the same.

    Maybe it’s placebo but I feel like it’s made a difference. I feel tired, like normal, but not nearly as groggy. Today I’m running on around 4.5 hrs of sleep and my mental acuity feels like I got more.

    Going to keep this updated.
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