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    Registered User TheIpodPeople's Avatar
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    My thoughts and DIY Supplements, Pre-Workouts, Blate Papes, etc

    So this is something I've noticed around the forums. It's been years since I was a serious forum browser and poster but I recently came back to see if I've been missing out.

    I'm seeing a lot of the same old things that have been asked many times. Threads like "which pre-workout should I take?" or "what's a good stack for me?"

    I'm thinking back to when I first started getting serious into working out. I was on forums 24/7, doing this same exact thing. I was looking for the next big thing, or I was asking questions until I got the answer I really wanted. I would read and read and read and finally find someone that said they did what I wanted to do, so then I could too. For me that started with pro-hormones, and went up (or down) from there.


    Well, after a few years of sticking with lifting, and general health/fitness, I stopped the constant hunting and searching for the next best thing, because I realized that there just isn't one.

    The same tried and true chemicals that everyone has used for years are still being used. I'm talking things like citrulline, arginine, beta, creatine, etc. Looking at it now from the maturing I've done, I realize that I would never want to try some new unheard of product any more anyway, at least not until it's actually stuck around a while. So many things come and go and are just pump n dump products.


    For 6+ years now I've been just using the same bulk ingredient stacks on and off. Not only just pre-workout, although that's a big part of it, but really everything like BCAAS and vitamins too. Maybe I'll drop creatine for a while after I run out, maybe I'll buy it again when I feel like I need a boost.
    The only difference between my stack and a company's $45 blends or products is that it comes with much more and doesn't have all the extra fillers, sweeteners etc. Yeah most powders taste like a$$ though so I put them in blate papes because capsules are a b*tch to fill and I don't have mix it with something else.

    As far as I can tell, my stack is still the same stack that is in the top selling products. Just seeing this now, I wanted to give my advice to those of you that are newer, or are looking for the next big thing: just use what works. It doesn't matter what it is, just make sure it has been around, and you know what it does.

    I've found that the most important thing for me, with both health supplements and fitness in general, is time and consistency. But using a ton of different brand product mixes breaks the bank and can sometimes leave you feeling dependent on them. To be completely honest, once I stopped looking for short cuts and started playing the long game, I began feeling better than I ever had in my life.
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    up the dosage eatyourspinach's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TheIpodPeople View Post

    The same tried and true chemicals that everyone has used for years are still being used. I'm talking things like citrulline, arginine, beta, creatine, etc. Looking at it now from the maturing I've done, I realize that I would never want to try some new unheard of product any more anyway, at least not until it's actually stuck around a while. So many things come and go and are just pump n dump products.


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    Cybergenics...it's bomb! lucia316's Avatar
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    Well, if you're doing the thing you shared in the other video, you're underdosing the ingredients and using ingredients that don't actually do very much from a weight lifting perspective (eg. Beta Alanine) unless you're double and triple scooping it. At that point, you're overdosing some of these things.

    I also agree with Spinach. Not quite at all. There are some core things, but there's always something new. The reality, the difference is so minute, even with your suggested ingredients, that you'd likely never know the difference anyhow including when you claim "insane pumps" that's partly placebo.
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    Registered User TheResistance's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by lucia316 View Post
    Well, if you're doing the thing you shared in the other video, you're underdosing the ingredients and using ingredients that don't actually do very much from a weight lifting perspective (eg. Beta Alanine) unless you're double and triple scooping it. At that point, you're overdosing some of these things.

    I also agree with Spinach. Not quite at all. There are some core things, but there's always something new. The reality, the difference is so minute, even with your suggested ingredients, that you'd likely never know the difference anyhow including when you claim "insane pumps" that's partly placebo.
    Can you list the useful pre-workout ingredients, the debatable and the useless.
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    Registered User urbanlifter's Avatar
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    Supplements are a complete waste of time for most people, with the exception of the guys who are looking to step on stage or a platform. Like many of the young guns here I spent 5-6 years (and hundreds of dollars) chasing products with the 'latest and greatest' ingredients, only to realize that they made zero difference when incorporated into my nutrition plan. Protein powder, recovery products, creatine, pre-workout supplements, ect. Eat good food, drink lots of water, get good sleep, and maybe add in the occasional caffeine boost for a workout when you are tired. My best advice to the younger guys on the forum would be to invest the money in quality home gym equipment and stop looking for the 'Magic Pill'. Because like Arnold says, there is no magic pill.....(that is legal at least LOL)
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    MANwhore mtpaquette's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by urbanlifter View Post
    Supplements are a complete waste of time for most people, with the exception of the guys who are looking to step on stage or a platform.
    You'll never take my preworkouts. lol
    Supplement a good diet: don't diet on supplements.

    MAN Sports Lead Rep

    Disclaimer: The statement above reflects that of my own opinion & in no way that of MAN Sports. Our products are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease.

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    Cybergenics...it's bomb! lucia316's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TheResistance View Post
    Can you list the useful pre-workout ingredients, the debatable and the useless.
    Based on that video, as I recall, everything was underdosed except for the Beatine.

    What's useful as an ingredient is dependent upon what you want out of your pre, what you're doing (activity-wise) and your goals.

    For weightlifting and body comp goals, beta alanine is pretty much worthless, worse so when it's underdosed and missing saturation. Because it works via saturation, timing isn't dependent.
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    Registered User urbanlifter's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by mtpaquette View Post
    You'll never take my preworkouts. lol
    Why? They got that magic formula? haha
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    MANwhore mtpaquette's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by urbanlifter View Post
    Why? They got that magic formula? haha
    Caffeine is my vice, and I'm a pump fiend. Pretty much the only supps I take anymore are preworkout focused to try and make every lift the best I can.
    Supplement a good diet: don't diet on supplements.

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    Registered User Dylanpe's Avatar
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    I am also a big caffeine lover and I would never change that!
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    Registered User TheIpodPeople's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by lucia316 View Post
    Based on that video, as I recall, everything was underdosed except for the Beatine.

    What's useful as an ingredient is dependent upon what you want out of your pre, what you're doing (activity-wise) and your goals.

    For weightlifting and body comp goals, beta alanine is pretty much worthless, worse so when it's underdosed and missing saturation. Because it works via saturation, timing isn't dependent.
    I appreciate your input, bro. Those doses are for all body types, which is really such a hard idea to generalize. Two scoops is fine for a bigger person, one scoop for girls, etc.

    I do have to disagree with your statement about new supplements. They're just not new. IF there was a new supplement that was so killer it broke the market, then it too, would be in every formula out there. But it's not. Our bodies aren't changing any time soon. Does anyone remember SARMS? LOL. I laughed the first time I read about those back in 2012 or so.

    Unless we have another CRAZE situation in which maybe they throw some var in along with that speed and label it creatine, then I don't see any supplement worth the price tag coming out. I guarantee you point out the guys around the board with real GRIT, they'll tell you that they've taken the same, cheap stuff for a long time. It just doesn't pay to keep trying all this random sh*t. I leave the guinea pigging to the newbies.
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    Registered User TheIpodPeople's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by urbanlifter View Post
    Supplements are a complete waste of time for most people, with the exception of the guys who are looking to step on stage or a platform. Like many of the young guns here I spent 5-6 years (and hundreds of dollars) chasing products with the 'latest and greatest' ingredients, only to realize that they made zero difference when incorporated into my nutrition plan. Protein powder, recovery products, creatine, pre-workout supplements, ect. Eat good food, drink lots of water, get good sleep, and maybe add in the occasional caffeine boost for a workout when you are tired. My best advice to the younger guys on the forum would be to invest the money in quality home gym equipment and stop looking for the 'Magic Pill'. Because like Arnold says, there is no magic pill.....(that is legal at least LOL)
    I agree with this for sure. I've found that the cheap bulk powders I buy and assemble myself have always worked for me better than any company's supplement formulas. I believed it was because I made the dose. But lately I've really been thinking that it is just in my head.. because if we think it works, it actually will.

    If you haven't looked into this, the placebo effect has actually been proven legitimately real. If we believe a sugar pill works, it actually physically affects us. In fact, I read into a study recently in which they took a bunch of hotel maids that have worked for years in the same hotel. They split them into a control and a test group. Then they told the control group nothing, and told the test group that their jobs are physically demanding, to the point of actual exercise. That's all they said, nothing else changed. No more work, working out, etc. Over the next 8 or 12 weeks, I forget which, those maids that were told their work is exercise, gained significant lean body mass and loss lbs of fat, without changing anything other than THAT KNOWLEDGE. Nothing changed to the control.

    Power of the F*ckin mind people.

    Then again, no sugar pill will replace test in my eye anytime soon. It just reconfirms the insanity of this industry and human behavior in general.
    Last edited by TheIpodPeople; 10-26-2020 at 01:21 PM. Reason: misspelled power as powder. Classic.
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    Cybergenics...it's bomb! lucia316's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TheIpodPeople View Post
    I appreciate your input, bro. Those doses are for all body types, which is really such a hard idea to generalize. Two scoops is fine for a bigger person, one scoop for girls, etc.
    Well the doses of efficacy are based on the studies done. In most cases, the differences are not that significant. Eg. Creatine is 3-5g for just about all people excluding ridiculous outliers.

    Originally Posted by TheIpodPeople View Post
    do have to disagree with your statement about new supplements. They're just not new. IF there was a new supplement that was so killer it broke the market, then it too, would be in every formula out there. But it's not. Our bodies aren't changing any time soon. Does anyone remember SARMS? LOL. I laughed the first time I read about those back in 2012 or so.
    You disagree based on what? There are new ingredients. There is new research that shows new things about existing ingredients (differing dosages, timing potentially, etc) that changes profiles. Some supps sell **** profiles. Some sell great profiles. Some brands have better flavor profiles, some don't. Some have spokesmen that people relate to, others don't. There are plenty of reasons that people buy supps.

    Regardless, the point is that even with the new, as supps make up such a small percentage of success that you'd likely never know the difference. This includes your placebo about "insane pumps" from underdosed ingredients.

    SARMS are still around and still sell. Just like your opinion based on placebo, as are those.

    Originally Posted by TheIpodPeople View Post
    Unless we have another CRAZE situation in which maybe they throw some var in along with that speed and label it creatine, then I don't see any supplement worth the price tag coming out. I guarantee you point out the guys around the board with real GRIT, they'll tell you that they've taken the same, cheap stuff for a long time. It just doesn't pay to keep trying all this random sh*t. I leave the guinea pigging to the newbies.
    Value is based on the individual. You clearly find value in your underdosed concoction as it delivers insane placebo pumps. I wouldn't waste money on it. Your opinion of "grit" is also subjective as is your and their anecdotal evidence of what does or doesn't do anything. Again, all supplements make up such a small percentage of success you'd never know the difference. If that's what you think, quit wasting your money on all supplements.

    Originally Posted by TheIpodPeople View Post
    I agree with this for sure. I've found that the cheap bulk powders I buy and assemble myself have always worked for me better than any company's supplement formulas. I believed it was because I made the dose. But lately I've really been thinking that it is just in my head.. because if we think it works, it actually will.
    The very definition of placebo..


    Originally Posted by TheIpodPeople View Post
    If you haven't looked into this, the placebo effect has actually been proven legitimately real. If we believe a sugar pill works, it actually physically affects us. In fact, I read into a study recently in which they took a bunch of hotel maids that have worked for years in the same hotel. They split them into a control and a test group. Then they told the control group nothing, and told the test group that their jobs are physically demanding, to the point of actual exercise. That's all they said, nothing else changed. No more work, working out, etc. Over the next 8 or 12 weeks, I forget which, those maids that were told their work is exercise, gained significant lean body mass and loss lbs of fat, without changing anything other than THAT KNOWLEDGE. Nothing changed to the control.
    So they created recomp in their mind? You're taking Langer's study out of context and misrepresenting it. The experimental group was educated about diet and researchers carefully went through each of the tasks they did each day, explaining how many calories those tasks burned. They were informed that the activity already met the surgeon general's definition of an active lifestyle.

    In the group that had been educated, there was a decrease in their systolic blood pressure, weight, and waist-to-hip ratio — and a 10 percent drop in blood pressure. There was nothing about an increase in lean body mass. The data was also challenged and there's a very high likelihood that they behaved differently after they were educated and they more likely changed their eating habits and/or increased activity. As a result, their health improved within the context of the actual measurements that Langer took.



    Originally Posted by TheIpodPeople View Post
    Power of the F*ckin mind people.

    Then again, no sugar pill will replace test in my eye anytime soon. It just reconfirms the insanity of this industry and human behavior in general.
    So no, it doesn't reconfirm anything. It simply leads us to education potentially means changes. This wasn't placebo. A placebo can help change something like your perception of pain or perhaps your sense of whether you feel depressed, but it can't do something objective like shrink a tumor or cut three pounds off your waistline.
    Last edited by lucia316; 10-26-2020 at 06:36 PM.
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