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    T.U.L.I.P. Tb0282's Avatar
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    Why you may not need Incline Bench

    Nothing in this thread is an original thought, the quotes in this thread are from Dante Trudel, the creator of DogCrapp Training and Spiderman997, the one and only. I'm simply organizing their thoughts into one thread.




    If you have a chest like the green highlights, you can emphasize the upper head by pressing on a slight incline. The joint angle does not have to change much at all to distribute the load onto the upper pec, because it's already such a larger percentage of your total chest mass.

    If you don't have this kind of chest, you have the red highlighted insertion: a high clavicular insertion. By the time you get the joint angle high enough to actually distribute the weight onto the upper chest, your delts will take over the movement and it becomes a shoulder exercise. If this is you, you would be better off doing the reverse of what most people do, make military press your primary pressing exercise over bench, and do chest work as assistance.

    When you have a high clavicular insertion (red highlight) This generally means you will be better 'suited' to being a standing presser because you tend to recruit shoulders and upper chest best when doing military press.

    You would probably do better if you just dropped the idea of bench being your main mass builder. You would do better from an aesthetic perspective if you focused on an overhead pressing movement instead as your shoulder girdle is designed to grow better in that plane of motion. You'll see a lot more growth in upper chest + traps + shoulders that way.

    Focus on standing overhead press + assistance work as your main mass movements for upper body, then add in a press on a decline or a pec iso for chest mass. If you're doing a Push Pull Legs routine, your Push day will end up looking something like this:

    Standing press with db or bb
    Lateral raises
    Face pulls from a low pulley
    Decline db bench
    Tricep iso

    If you're not sure whether or not you have a high clavicular insertion or a low clavicular insertion, feel free to post pics in this thread, and myself and possibly others will be glad to help.
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    Registered Sick Kunt tekno17's Avatar
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    What about me?

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    Incline will work for you
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    Hey I just met you. And this is crazy. But today is chest day. So spot me maybe?

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    Registered Sick Kunt tekno17's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Tb0282 View Post
    Incline will work for you
    I have also read from some body builders. That if you have good shoulder insertions. You dont need to shoulder press and can just Facepull + Side lat raise for shoulders. because your front delts get nailed on bench day anyways.. Is that true?
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    T.U.L.I.P. Tb0282's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by tekno17 View Post
    I have also read from some body builders. That if you have good shoulder insertions. You dont need to shoulder press and can just Facepull + Side lat raise for shoulders. because your front delts get nailed on bench day anyways.. Is that true?
    Yeah that's true.

    Insertions change everything
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    Registered User crazdave's Avatar
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    Can you give a better explanation on how to spot the different insertions?
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    Originally Posted by crazdave View Post
    Can you give a better explanation on how to spot the different insertions?

    I can post images of each when I'm off mobile.
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    So say you do incline and your upper chest (only) is sore, that means with my insertions upper chest is worked through incline rather than overhead press, correct?
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    Registered User mattqchou's Avatar
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    Great thread. Do insertions affect how you should do other lifts as well? (Other than chest targeting ones). How do you work the muscle right below (.5 cm) the collarbone? I have like nothing there, and below that are the pecs. Unless those are the insertions you're talking about.

    In to find out if I have an high or low insertion.
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    im hungry mmafighter1294's Avatar
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    Confirmed my upper chest grew considerably when I dropped incline press and added in OHP
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  11. #11
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    What about me? I know I'm not lean but can you tell. Btw which is better, normal chest or chest that likes to incline?
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    Registered User parth95's Avatar
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    Excellent read man!! I don't know which category I fall under sadly.. Can you tell from looking at my avi??
    And also let me know which pressing I'll mostly benefit from?!
    If you cannot tell from avi, then from my Photo on my bodyspace? It's gonna be the "before" picture(I only have those two photos uploaded)
    I'm on my mobile and I won't have access to a computer for a while..
    Much appreciated
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  13. #13
    T.U.L.I.P. Tb0282's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Nitsua24 View Post
    So say you do incline and your upper chest (only) is sore, that means with my insertions upper chest is worked through incline rather than overhead press, correct?
    No not really. I can tell you that you have a high clavicular insertion. My chest gets sore from doing a ton of pushups, but is it optimal for growth? No. Your shoulder girdle is designed to grow best from standing presses

    Originally Posted by mattqchou View Post
    Great thread. Do insertions affect how you should do other lifts as well? (Other than chest targeting ones). How do you work the muscle right below (.5 cm) the collarbone? I have like nothing there, and below that are the pecs. Unless those are the insertions you're talking about.

    In to find out if I have an high or low insertion.
    Not all insertions affect exercise selection, but all insertions will affect you in some way. For instance, short vs long bicep insertions. Long bicep insertions are optimal for growth, you'll be able to get 18 inch arms, people with short bicep insertions will have the nice full looking bicep with a peak, but they'll have a hard time getting over 16.5 inches.

    The clavicular head attaches to the collarbone (aka clavicle, which is how it got its name). Chances are, if you "have nothing there" you're either really small, or you have a high clavicular insertion suited for OHP

    Originally Posted by mmafighter1294 View Post
    Confirmed my upper chest grew considerably when I dropped incline press and added in OHP
    Figured you'd be in this thread <3

    Originally Posted by the5thhorseman View Post
    What about me? I know I'm not lean but can you tell. Btw which is better, normal chest or chest that likes to incline?
    You've got a high clavicular insertion.

    Originally Posted by parth95 View Post
    Excellent read man!! I don't know which category I fall under sadly.. Can you tell from looking at my avi??
    And also let me know which pressing I'll mostly benefit from?!
    If you cannot tell from avi, then from my Photo on my bodyspace? It's gonna be the "before" picture(I only have those two photos uploaded)
    I'm on my mobile and I won't have access to a computer for a while..
    Much appreciated
    You've got great chest insertions. Be glad. Incline will work great for you.
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    Hey I just met you. And this is crazy. But today is chest day. So spot me maybe?

    Art thou prone to such insurmountable force upon thou biceps?
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  14. #14
    One with the Force TheJediBrah's Avatar
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    Always love Spiderman's work but I still don't think Incline is necessarily that important for anyone
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    T.U.L.I.P. Tb0282's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by crazdave View Post
    Can you give a better explanation on how to spot the different insertions?
    High clavicular insertion



    Low clavicular inseriton

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    Hey I just met you. And this is crazy. But today is chest day. So spot me maybe?

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  16. #16
    T.U.L.I.P. Tb0282's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TheJediBrah View Post
    Always love Spiderman's work but I still don't think Incline is necessarily that important for anyone
    Its not for the most part. The people who have the right insertions for incline bench would still be able to develop an impressive upper chest without it.
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    im hungry mmafighter1294's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TheJediBrah View Post
    Always love Spiderman's work but I still don't think Incline is necessarily that important for anyone
    depends on what your goal is. I doubt you'll meet an IFBB pro that doesn't incline press though.
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    One with the Force TheJediBrah's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by mmafighter1294 View Post
    depends on what your goal is. I doubt you'll meet an IFBB pro that doesn't incline press though.
    Not really

    Most of how IFFB pros train is guesswork and based on assumptions. brb need to do Incline to hit upper chest, brb closer grip to work inner chest, brb "pre exhausting" muscles
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    Registered User CLB33's Avatar
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    Can you tell from my avi?
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    T.U.L.I.P. Tb0282's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by CLB33 View Post
    Can you tell from my avi?
    No, I cannot.
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    Hey I just met you. And this is crazy. But today is chest day. So spot me maybe?

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    Originally Posted by Tb0282 View Post
    No, I cannot.
    http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/im...qhVBHdwLKE.jpg

    Does that help any? lol
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    Not really. Not the best angle to judge by. If I had to guess I'd say you have a high clavicular insertion, although its hard to be sure with that picture.
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  23. #23
    Registered Loser koloxid's Avatar
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    high insertion checking in

    thanks op for relaying the info
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  24. #24
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    Great thread. RIP Spiderman

    Aight, so from what I can see, you remember WK's avi? Those were low clavicular insertions, am I correct?
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  25. #25
    No pain,no gain flame66's Avatar
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    Great thread. Repped!

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  26. #26
    T.U.L.I.P. Tb0282's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by letsdothisbro View Post
    Great thread. RIP Spiderman

    Aight, so from what I can see, you remember WK's avi? Those were low clavicular insertions, am I correct?
    Those were high. They just inserted lower on the Intertubercular Groove (Outer Lip)

    Originally Posted by flame66 View Post
    Great thread. Repped!

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    Do you have any front chest pics? Looks like a high clavicular insertion, although its generally hard to tell from that angle
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  27. #27
    Registered User letsdothisbro's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Tb0282 View Post
    Those were high. They just inserted lower on the Intertubercular Groove (Outer Lip)



    Do you have any front chest pics? Looks like a high clavicular insertion, although its generally hard to tell from that angle
    It's funny how one can immediately tell you're GSF, lol
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  28. #28
    T.U.L.I.P. Tb0282's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by koloxid View Post
    high insertion checking in

    thanks op for relaying the info
    Any time man. I was mind blown when I first saw Spider posting about this lol

    Originally Posted by letsdothisbro View Post
    It's funny how one can immediately tell you're GSF, lol
    cause of my user title? lol
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  29. #29
    Registered User letsdothisbro's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Tb0282 View Post
    Any time man. I was mind blown when I first saw Spider posting about this lol



    cause of my user title? lol
    no, because you actually know your chit, and you're koala tea, I'm on GSF, too, don't post but I lurk for some koala tea help some time
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  30. #30
    Teen Bodybuilding Manager s58's Avatar
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    So what if a person who has high insertion did incline flies? Would that help at all?
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