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  1. #211
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    Originally Posted by Cumulonimbus View Post
    EXACTLY. IIFYM =/= eat what ever macros.
    Originally Posted by ko300zx View Post
    That's not what your sticky says. It doesn't talk about fitting foods into my macros. It talks about how I should fill my remaining calories with macros of my choice. I don't have "remaining calories."
    It doesn't say to fill the remaining calories with macros of your choice. It says foods of your choice. Your choice may be dependent on;
    -Satiety
    -Taste
    -Optimal performance, in which case you'd more than likely fill your remaining calories with carbohydrates.

    Your remaining calories are your goal calorie intake minus your minimum fat/protein requirements, once again, explained in the sticky.

    Suggestion:
    -Perhaps the content of the sticky is changed to emphasise irrelevancy of food choices, I'll create a separate thread with my guide (which can be unstickied) which I can link in the [newly reformed] IIFYM sticky showing a newbie guide how to fit things into their macros after setting the up with minimums. Thoughts?
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  2. #212
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    Originally Posted by YeomenKek View Post
    Thoughts?
    As I stated earlier, I think there needs to be one simplified introductory thread stickied that covers the primary questions that are frequently which would include the core concepts of IIFYM's in a manner that integrates into a basic primer on nutrition.
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  3. #213
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    Originally Posted by YeomenKek View Post
    Your remaining calories are your goal calorie intake minus your minimum fat/protein requirements, once again, explained in the sticky.
    I don't know how many times I have to state I clearly understand what the remaining calories refers to.

    What I want to know is how to apply IIFYM, as you define it

    "The phrase If It Fits Your Macros (often abbreviated to IIFYM) refers to meeting the individual macronutrient needs relevant to one's goals and then filling the remaining calories with foods of personal preference."
    when my total remaining calories is zero, none, non-existent.

    Originally Posted by YeomenKek View Post
    Suggestion:
    -Perhaps the content of the sticky is changed to emphasise irrelevancy of food choices, I'll create a separate thread with my guide (which can be unstickied) which I can link in the [newly reformed] IIFYM sticky showing a newbie guide how to fit things into their macros after setting the up with minimums. Thoughts?
    Probably a good idea.
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  4. #214
    Pizzabrah YeomenKek's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by WonderPug View Post
    As I stated earlier, I think there needs to be one simplified introductory thread stickied that covers the primary questions that are frequently which would include the core concepts of IIFYM's in a manner that integrates into a basic primer on nutrition.
    Perhaps the current sticky title is changed to an introductory newbie guide, and somewhere in the OP make mention of IIFYM, food choices & their irrelevancy on body composition outside of sufficient macro/micronutrient intake based on individual needs.

    Perhaps a link to Erik's IIFYM too.
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  5. #215
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    ^ I think the ideal solution is a simple yet relatively comprehensive Primer on Nutrition sticky that would cover all the basics in an integrated and easily understandable manner, with links to more detailed discussions and to research in support of the underlying assertions contained therein.
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  6. #216
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    Originally Posted by ko300zx View Post
    I don't know how many times I have to state I clearly understand what the remaining calories refers to.

    What I want to know is how to apply IIFYM, as you define it



    when my total remaining calories is zero, none, non-existent.



    Probably a good idea.
    Ok this is the last time I'll respond to you unless it's a suggestion, I'm getting very tired of repeating myself. Your remaining calories are what's left in your goal calorie intake after consuming the minimum amount of nutrients your body needs to survive. If you 'clearly understand' what the remaining calories refer too, stop asking me to keep defining it.
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  7. #217
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    Originally Posted by WonderPug View Post
    ^ I think the ideal solution is a simple yet relatively comprehensive Primer on Nutrition sticky that would cover all the basics in an integrated and easily understandable manner, with links to more detailed discussions and to research in support of the underlying assertions contained therein.
    Sounds good, if people aren't against the current sticky without all the IIFYM tags as simply a newbie guide, I'll begin rewording it so it can be a standalone starter thread like you're describing.

    If anyone has some links to good discussion or threads missing from the current sticky, they'd be good to throw in now.
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  8. #218
    Registered User ko300zx's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by YeomenKek View Post
    Ok this is the last time I'll respond to you unless it's a suggestion, I'm getting very tired of repeating myself. Your remaining calories are what's left in your goal calorie intake after consuming the minimum amount of nutrients your body needs to survive. If you 'clearly understand' what the remaining calories refer too, stop asking me to keep defining it.
    Lol. I'm not asking you to define the remaining calories. Man you are thick. No wonder you don't understand what IIFYM is.

    The phrase If It Fits Your Macros (often abbreviated to IIFYM) refers to meeting the individual macronutrient needs relevant to one's goals and then filling the remaining calories with foods of personal preference.
    You state as your definition of IIFYM:
    1. Calculate your macros (with the link you provide).
    2. Fill the remaining calories with foods of personal preference.

    Ok. I'll do this.
    1. 90/425/200 - Calorie goal 3310. From the sticky you directed me to.
    2. Remaining calories = 0.

    Now answer my question I've asked 5 times now if you can understand it.

    PS. The sticky you send everyone to for macro calculation does not tell you to only hit a minimum amount of certain macros, and neither does the definition you wrote, so why is your example and your entire position you are defending based off of this "minimums" concept you keep stressing?
    Last edited by ko300zx; 07-24-2011 at 06:05 PM.
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  9. #219
    Chasing cats since 1967 WonderPug's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by YeomenKek View Post
    Sounds good, if people aren't against the current sticky without all the IIFYM tags as simply a newbie guide, I'll begin rewording it so it can be a standalone starter thread like you're describing.
    I don't think the sticky should be titled IIFYM's or anything similar.

    I think there needs to be a clearly marked introduction to nutrition, which is what newbies can start with.
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  10. #220
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    Originally Posted by Lvisaa2 View Post
    If IIFYM were to be dumbed up then I think it should be done with all the stickies. If people think IIFYM is confusing then getting through the macro calculations is equally as confusing. Here is the way I'd construct a conglomerate thread of 'noob' instructions.

    Dieting for Dummies

    There are numerous 'experts' and fitness buffs who will regurgitate unfounded myths and unnecessary dietary regiments. This is designed to help you create a diet that will help you progress, but also be enjoyable and encourage adherence.

    Calculating Maintenance Level
    Use either of the two formulas below to calculate your BMR. The first will be most accurate considering you have a good estimate of your body fat percentage. Note, that your BMR will need to be multiplied by an activity factor to find your maintenance. Additionally, these are simply ESTIMATES, you will need to adjust based on your results.

    1.Katch-McArdle:
    Use ONLY if you have a good estimate of your bodyfat percentage.
    BMR = 370 + (21.6 x LBM)
    Where LBM = [total weight (kg) x (100 - bodyfat %)]/100

    2.Mifflin-St Jeor:
    WILL OVERESTIMATES NEEDS, ESPECIALLY IN THE OVERWEIGHT.
    For MEN: BMR = [9.99 x weight (kg)] + [6.25 x height (cm)] - [4.92 x age (years)] + 5
    For WOMEN: BMR = [9.99 x weight (kg)] + [6.25 x height (cm)] - [4.92 x age (years)] -161

    Once finding your BMR, you need to multiply it by one of the follow activity factors:
    1.2 = Sedentary (Little or no exercise and desk job)
    1.3-1.4 = Lightly Active (Little daily activity & light exercise 1-3 days a week)
    1.5-1.6 = Moderately Active (Moderately active daily life & Moderate exercise 3-5 days a week)
    1.7-1.8 = Very Active (Physically demanding lifestyle & Hard exercise or sports 6-7 days a week)
    1.9-2.0 = Extremely Active (Hard daily exercise or sports and physical job)


    Calculating Necessary Deficit or Surplus
    To lose weight, you will need to be in a caloric deficit(i.e. eating less than maintenance). To find a proper deficit then eat 10-20% less than maintenance.
    To gain weight, you will need to be in a caloric surplus(i.e. eating more than maintenance). To find a surplus deficit then eat 10-20% less than maintenance.

    Calculating Macros

    Note: Your body does not run on ratios, therefore you should calculate absolute numbers.

    Protein:
    1-1.5g of protein per pound of lean body mass is generally a good place to start. If in a deficit then the higher range of protein will be more muscle sparing.

    Fats:
    Average or lean: 0.45 - 1g total weight / pounds
    High bodyfat: 0.45 - 1g LBM / pounds
    If low calorie dieting - you can decrease further, but as a minimum, I would not suggest LESS than about 0.35g/ pound


    Carbohydrates:

    Carbohydrates can constitute the rest of your calories.
    Carb calories = Total calorie needs - ([protein grams as above x 4] + [fat grams as above x 9])]
    Carbs in grams = above total/ 4


    Note: These are protein and fat MINIMUMS. You should hit these and then you can subsequently fill in the rest of your calories how you see fit. Although it is suggested that you fill in most of the remaining calories with carbohydrates.

    Meal frequency

    Meal frequency is completely irrelevant. Eating more times a day does not provide any metabolic advantage. You should eat based upon a schedule that you enjoy and that fits your diet. Some people will enjoy more frequent and smaller meals, while others will enjoy larger and less frequent meals.

    Pre/Post Workout Nutrition

    Pre and Post workout nutrition is largely irrelevant. Unless you are an athlete training multiple times a day then body composition will be based almost solely on your daily nutrition.

    Food Choices

    Food choices are irrelevant on body composition. Fill your macros how you see fit with whatever food you'd like. There is no need to eat 'clean'.

    Note: As with anything, moderation is key. You should stick to mostly whole, unprocessed foods to sufficiently meet your micronutrient needs. Additionally, you should always keep satiety in mind and eat in a way which will not leave you hungry.

    ------------------------------

    Basic outline. Add in links where appropriate to studys/posts/etc that support what was said.
    If someone is looking to re-tool and create an overall introductory thread, feel free to use my basic outline mentioned earlier.

    I would even do it if no one else wants to, it would just take me a few days to establish the exact format and necessary links that would best represent the knowledge needed for the newcomers

    Edit: I think it may be beneficial to keep the previous stickies and have this link to those for people who want a more comprehensive guide
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  11. #221
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    Originally Posted by Lvisaa2 View Post
    If someone is looking to re-tool and create an overall introductory thread, feel free to use my basic outline mentioned earlier.

    I would even do it if no one else wants to, it would just take me a few days to establish the exact format and necessary links that would best represent the knowledge needed for the newcomers

    Edit: I think it may be beneficial to keep the previous stickies and have this link to those for people who want a more comprehensive guide
    It would be best to start a suggestion thread and have multiple people contribute to it rather than the thoughts of only one person. Give it two weeks to develop fully and then organize it into a complete thread.
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  12. #222
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    Originally Posted by sawoobley View Post
    It would be best to start a suggestion thread and have multiple people contribute to it rather than the thoughts of only one person. Give it two weeks to develop fully and then organize it into a complete thread.
    But then people will fight over who gets to create the sticky and have their name against it

    Not that it matters
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  13. #223
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    I think Alan should create it so we can nitpick him to death.
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    Originally Posted by AlwaysTryin View Post
    But then people will fight over who gets to create the sticky and have their name against it

    Not that it matters
    As the current IIFYM debate suggests, it is not necessarily always beneficial to have your name associated with it as it means you then feel compelled to defend it. IMO if we took it took a group format we could make a bogus account, with consent of a mod, that symbolized the combination of the effort of the whole population of the forum.
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    Originally Posted by WonderPug View Post
    ^ I think the ideal solution is a simple yet relatively comprehensive Primer on Nutrition sticky that would cover all the basics in an integrated and easily understandable manner, with links to more detailed discussions and to research in support of the underlying assertions contained therein.
    I think this is the best approach and would be the easiest format to add on to, alter, or expand as needed.
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    Originally Posted by Lvisaa2 View Post
    As the current IIFYM debate suggests, it is not necessarily always beneficial to have your name associated with it as it means you then feel compelled to defend it. IMO if we took it took a group format we could make a bogus account, with consent of a mod, that symbolized the combination of the effort of the whole population of the forum.
    Or a mod could just sticky it
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  17. #227
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    Originally Posted by Lvisaa2 View Post
    If someone is looking to re-tool and create an overall introductory thread, feel free to use my basic outline mentioned earlier.

    I would even do it if no one else wants to, it would just take me a few days to establish the exact format and necessary links that would best represent the knowledge needed for the newcomers

    Edit: I think it may be beneficial to keep the previous stickies and have this link to those for people who want a more comprehensive guide
    ^ half of that is simply a 'cut and paste' from my sticky.
    No point in having it 'stickied' two times.
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  18. #228
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    Originally Posted by Emma-Leigh View Post
    ^ half of that is simply a 'cut and paste' from my sticky.
    No point in having it 'stickied' two times.
    The point of it was to have it simplified. As I said, it was hastily thrown together attempt at starting a guideline that we could expand upon. As I stated previously in this thread, I find the stickies fine the way they are; when I came here I read them and understood them. Yet, it seems that there may be a need for an all inclusive guide that takes everything and makes it in a short/specific nutrition guide. I am by no means trying to 'steal' your stickies thunder, just trying to start something so we can actually get somewhere rather than argue back and forth about what a sticky may or may not imply, especially since it's blatantly obvious that neither side was making any headway.

    Additionally, I think the sticky should include links to the other stickies to provide more advanced reading if they would want to get more than the basics.
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    Ok - what I'll do is I'll UNSTICK the current IIFYM thread.
    Instead - what about I stick a 'NUTRITION FOR NEWBIES thread Creation' - in which people can submit a 'post' involving the basics of nutrition.

    Give it a few days / weeks to be filled in.

    Then we can create something from the posts...

    How does that sound?
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